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Notes/Domino 6 and 7 Forum

Notes/Domino 6 and 7 Forum


  

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RE: You might ask: What's the point of this discussion?
~Umberto Nongeroson 2.Oct.02 03:49 PM a Web browser
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I appreciate all the comments from the host of folks yesterday. Many/most people had valid observations that put some good perspective on where we are going as Domino-related professionals. Actually, one very good point was that we shouldn't think of ourselves as Domino-related professionals. It's usually a very bad thing to tie yourself to one platform. I think IBM has taken this to heart. <GDR>. Also, rereading some of my posts, I came across much harsher than I intended. For that, I apologize!

My original comment ended with a question "what do you think?" b/c I wanted to see what other people of various backgrounds are feeling as Domino 6 (you may have noticed my pet peeve with dropping the Rx nomenclature) launches.

Just as a little background, I did download and review all available versions up through and including the release on Monday to Partnerworld. Domino 6 as a product is pretty much awesome. Unless something really weird comes up, it looks very good to roll with. A blessed change from R5.

And the future of Domino as laid out will be a good story to sell large clients. However, to address the concerns of current SMB and to win new SMB clients, I would appreciate clear, sellable answers from IBM to these questions:

<> What will Domino be 2+ years out? Will new significant features be Domino-based or added principally via integration with DB2/Tivoli/WebSphere - and therefore require them in addition to Domino? <>
In many ways, technology is like religion - people buy it because of what they believe it is AND what they believe it will become. At this point we have a clear, present (and excellent) product: Domino R6, er, 6. It is flexible, easy to develop in, and in a product line that is UNDERSTANDABLE by mere mortals.
The future beyond 18 months out is, in a word, "murky". In two words, "very complicated". It looks like the roadmap means the current functionality will be supported for the foreseeable future. This is good, but it isn't enough. That covers the "what they believe it is" part. When I get to thinking about "what it will become" and how to explain that to our customer base, I just .... dry up.

The impression I got from LotusSphere was that the excellent collaboration pieces will become applets (for lack of a better term) that can be called from WebSphere or another J2EE environment.
That's neat, and it certainly will look attractive to companies large enough to have significant development staffs. But it also gives the impression that Domino isn't 'evolving' - it's being grafted onto J2EE/WebSphere. And that's a difficult sell.

The bigger issue that we need to be able to directly answer is that IBM appears to be involved in a long-term effort to 'harmonize' it's product line. This is a valid thing for IBM to be doing. DB2 for data storage, WebSphere for high performance & adaptable web apps/services, Tivoli for management, and Lotus for Collaboration.

I think that it's something that IBM could reasonable do in order to present a clear marketing and direction message to large clients. The reason that I see an issue with this in my Notes/Domino developer role is that the 'classic Notes/Domino' doesn't fit this model. It can do most, if not all of the DB2, WebSphere and Lotus roles mentioned above.

On the surface, this puts the Notes/Domino that we're used to in direct conflict with the clear organizational direction IBM is taking.

--> Let me clear about this: Domino 6 is an excellent product that appears very solid and reliable. And we will use it, resell it, support it, and enjoy it. <--

But it doesn't change the long term direction that the roadmap lays out. There's a reason that Next Gen enters the highway from the WebSphere side on the 'roadmap to the future' graphic.

It will be very hard to sell WebSphere into SMB accounts, which is what we have here, mostly. It's a hard enough sell explaining what Notes/Domino is in the current release, much less explaining what it will become as it moves down the roadmap.

<> How can we sell WebSphere? <>
One of the hardest thing I have to do is explain what Notes/Domino is. No, it's not just email! No, it's not just SQLServer. No, it's not just a web server! After a number of years, I think we kind of have the routine down. But in the last year I've realized that explaining Domino is nothing compared to explaining the WebSphere brand (it's SKU heaven) - and the pricing is, well breathtaking. I just don't see how we can price it into our market.

<> Why does IBM seem to heavily favor WebSphere? <>
When my customers go to general IBM marketing events or get literature from IBM, it consistently pushes WebSphere. Unless the material comes from Lotus, you wouldn't really know that Domino exists. This makes it hard to convince customers that there's a future here.


Please comment on how you would answer these questions. I promise not
to rebute or comment further....

<SET Troll = Off>




REVISED: Where is Domino going? (~Dean Brefanama... 1.Oct.02)
. . Good question - however... (~Lorraine Umkit... 1.Oct.02)
. . RE: REVISED: Where is Domino going?... (~Zach Xankroplo... 1.Oct.02)
. . RE: REVISED: Where is Domino going?... (~Maria Dworesal... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . I find Domino/Notes ideal for SMB (~Vera Quethipip... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . RE: I find Domino/Notes ideal for S... (~Dean Brefanama... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . So what do you think... (~Vera Quethipip... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . . . RE: So what do you think... (Placeh... (~Dean Brefanama... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . *Stop trolling. It is getting old. ... (~Yentl Quetkrot... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . RE: REVISED: Where is Domino going?... (~Dean Brefanama... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . RE: troll troll go away (if you clo... (~Dean Brefanama... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . . . *It is OK to be worried, but this i... (~Yentl Quetkrot... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . . . . . RE: *It is OK to be worried, but th... (~Dean Brefanama... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . sorry, why not? (~Mario Cislugon... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . * LOL - sorry, why not? eom> (~Lex Ekweberg 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . RE: sorry, why not? (~Dean Brefanama... 2.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . RE: troll troll go away ... hide un... (~Patti Dwoavitc... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . *I don't realize any such thing. eo... (~Yentl Quetkrot... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . RE: I don't realize any such thing.... (~Dean Brefanama... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . . . RE: I don't realize any such thing.... (~Delores Dwonic... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . . . . . RE: I don't realize any such thing.... (~Dean Brefanama... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . . . OK, here you go (~Yentl Quetkrot... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . . . . . RE: *I don't realize any such thing... (~Dean Brefanama... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . RE: *I don't realize any such thing... (~Delores Dwonic... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . *I don't realize any such thing. (~Dean Brefanama... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . Man, I don't believe this... (~Dan Elhipister... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . For the record... re: Man, I don't ... (~Naomi Deskrote... 2.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . RE: *I don't realize any such thing... (~Dean Brefanama... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . interesting... to me the IBM Softwa... (~Lisa Lopresach... 14.Oct.02)
. . RE: REVISED: Where is Domino going?... (~Hank Nimtumipl... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . RE: REVISED: Where is Domino going?... (~Delores Dwonic... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . RE: REVISED: Where is Domino going?... (~Dean Brefanama... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . RE: REVISED: Where is Domino going?... (~Dean Brefanama... 1.Oct.02)
. . Some general comments from Lotus. (~Mario Cislugon... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . RE: Some general comments from Lotu... (~Dean Brefanama... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . RE: Some general comments from Lotu... (~Holly Minjipyb... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . RE: Some general comments from Lotu... (~Richard Rerebu... 1.Oct.02)
. . . . . . interesting... (~Lisa Lopresach... 14.Oct.02)
. . RE: You might ask: What's the point... (~Carol Bubtooze... 2.Oct.02)
. . . . RE: You might ask: What's the point... (~Frank Oplumare... 2.Oct.02)
. . . . I got the same impression from Lotu... (~Hal Xanjumitex... 4.Oct.02)


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